9.23.2011

Why So Few Black Women Marry White Men II

A reader emailed me about my recent BW/WM posts, which didn't sit well with them.  They felt that I dog that pairing too much.  Their perspective made me feel like I really needed to voice my thoughts on the issue once and for all.  This was my response to the reader (edited to preserve anonymity, of course, with additions for emphasis):

Dear Reader:

My posts are not about you nor couples like you. I noticed that when I wrote similar posts about Blasian couples - and I have more often than you'd think - you didn't rush to defend Asian men or AMBW relationships in general.

My attitude as a straight Black woman in America is very simple: I don't want any man to think he doesn't have to prove himself to us simply because he's also black, or he's also a man of color, or because he's white but "always found black women attractive" - that's simply not enough to me.

In general, men do not treat us the way they treat other women; in fact, most are still learning how. The problem, of course, is that they don't even see us as women sometimes. When non-black women ask men to prove themselves, men bring them the moon (and then set it into the marble pedestal they previously erected for those women). When we ask men to prove themselves, they're too busy laughing to even be annoyed or offended. And this is where my sociological perspective comes in: just because non-black men (in particular) show interest in us, I don't feel like we should pretend all is forgiven and forgotten - it's not.  They have to "come correct."  Because it's been my consistent observation that only the black woman is constantly asked to forgive and pretend, which does not - and will never - sit well with me.
I’ve been online for about 15 years now. And I started going to race relations/discussion boards almost immediately and have been participating in them in some form, one after the other. Basically, the same thing has happened over and over again, Black women (BW) participate in the discussions disproportionally and our contributions are never ever valued.

How are Black women treated on these sites? That can be summed up in one word: badly. ...On these sites, BW are treated like the ugly girl at the club. ...People ignore her, bump into her, even knock her down and don’t offer an “Excuse me,” forget about an “I’m sorry.” ...Some will actually glare at her and demand she look where she’s going or to keep her ugly ass out of the way. Others will wonder out loud what her ugly ass was even doing there since no one’d take home a dog like her.

I’ve been on sites where folks posted remarks telling BW not to post so much, accusing us of somehow drowning out or keeping other people, the people they really wanted there and whom they really valued, from commenting. One was a site for White men ironically to remove White women from the pedestal of perfect womanhood. As you can guess, the main participants were WM and BW. Some of the WM complained that BW were commenting too much.

...The thing was, the WM there didn’t want to create a more equitable beauty and desirability standard (debate about whether there should be either is a whole nuvvah post) for ALL women of color. Just certain ones. And Black women were NOT in that group.

~ Witchsistah, "They Don't Care"
And yes...I bring up the likes of Nita "Jade" Hanson because she's a classic example of forgiving and forgetting and letting shit slide. White men - much like white feminists - remain silent when women of color are publicly wronged/harmed. But in private...they want to get with us? They want us to "ignore" and "leave 'it' all in the past"?

Reader, I understand you married a great man. I learned a term on my blog a while back from Bcbgrl33 - "unicorn." You married a unicorn. You're one of the lucky ones because the average white man in America is most assuredly not a unicorn.  And these articles which keep coming out urging Black women to get themselves a white man (without any serious nationwide articles urging white men to get themselves a black woman), are basically telling us to forget and pretend that the reality of the situation is wholly different from what it is.

So I stand by my initial statements. If a Black woman finds herself a unicorn, by all means she should love him with all her heart (and once she establishes that he is, in fact, a unicorn, she should also seriously consider playing the lottery). She should most certainly not settle for anything less, but unfortunately, "less" is what's most widely available.

Recommended

Why So Few Black Women Marry White Men
Concerning BW/AM: Debunking Myths about Black Women
The Black Woman Attraction Paradox

51 comments:

  1. THIS

    My attitude as a straight Black woman in America is very simple: I don't want any man to think he doesn't have to prove himself to us simply because he's also black, or he's also a man of color, or because he's white but "always found black women attractive" - that's simply not enough to me.

    THIS

    In general, men do not treat us the way they treat other women; in fact, most are still learning how. The problem, of course, is that they don't even see us as women sometimes. When non-black women ask men to prove themselves, men bring them the moon (and then set it into the marble pedestal they previously erected for those women). When we ask men to prove themselves, they're too busy laughing to even be annoyed or offended. And this is where my sociological perspective comes in: just because non-black men (in particular) show interest in us, I don't feel like we should pretend all is forgiven and forgotten - it's not. They have to "come correct.

    and

    Ah, hell. Just consider this ENTIRE post ALL THAT!

    On my blog I have a title and a description like most blogs but I have noticed that I NEVA have as many negative notes about any of the descriptions as I do for the descriptions; BEAUTY and LOVE-- notes that they see me and those particular titles as being "unnecessary" because LOVE is LOVE or "a separatist" because to spotlight POC beauty is exclusionary of other beauty. O_o

    I have never responded in a post about this and maybe I should but I think this post clarifies exceptionally why these people choose to do what they do and should be shut down swiftly when they do!

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  2. In general, men do not treat us the way they treat other women

    THIS

    The older I get the more obvious this becomes. Many men approach me with highly informal language, basically they approach me like they know me when they don't,instead of with the more polite language usually reserved for strangers. In many cases the stranger will insist that he knows you from somewhere and even react in a hostile manner when you state the obvious: you don't know him.

    Men are not entitled to my attention and the least they can do is approach me with the same level of respect they would give a nonblack woman.

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  3. basically they approach me like they know me when they don't,instead of with the more polite language usually reserved for strangers. In many cases the stranger will insist that he knows you from somewhere and even react in a hostile manner when you state the obvious: you don't know him.

    A tactic that's beyond creepy. Puts me in mind of, ironically, The Strangers.

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  4. I was having a "discussion" on a forum regarding how some white men (and women for that matter) think its perfectly ok to talk down to, mistreat and generally disrespect black women. I was told that if black women didn't behave in such stereotypical ways then they would be treated with more respect. Let's just say I was floored at such foolish. The blame was squarely placed on black womens shoulders, and many posters even defended the white men who behaved in this way. To make matters worst, the majority of these comments were coming from people who claimed to be black women and men themselves smfh.

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  5. @ Sleepytime

    And this confirms my theory that with the natural hair movement and the rise of black female entrepreneurship, America is looking for a new way to control and make money off us. First, it's the articles giving us the message that we should - basically - throw ourselves at white men because they're our knights in shining armor just waiting for us to give them a chance.

    Meanwhile, white men are getting the message that all black women are the same, and they jokingly and derisively toss negative stereotypes about us to amuse and feel better about themselves.

    So...after enough black women have been inducted into the Order of the Doomed & Misguided, the self-help therapy market is going to return with a vengeance. This time, it will have all sorts of easily accessible, reasonably-priced eBooks filled with all manner of helpful how-to tips for thirsty black women on physically, mentally, and emotionally "reshaping" themselves to attract white men.

    But not a single book or article will come out for white men on to reshape themselves for black women.

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  6. Exactly. Black women are constantly bombarded with these "something is wrong with you and you need to do a,b and c to fix it" messages. Quite frankly I'm sick of the sh*t. Apparently there is nothing at all wrong the folks that hold these fucked up ideas about us, and if we call them out on it, we are STILL the ones with the problem. As far as this new idea that black women should start chasing after white men, more bullsh*t that I'm not buying. IMO it's never a good idea for women to chase after men period, especially potentially racist, condescending ones.

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  7. IMO it's never a good idea for women to chase after men period, especially potentially racist, condescending ones.

    And that's all I'm saying.

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  8. @ Ankh

    Meanwhile, white men are getting the message that all black women are the same, and they jokingly and derisively toss negative stereotypes about us to amuse and feel better about themselves.

    This right here pisses me off to no end. I've seen ignorant white males toss stereotypes out as casually as saying "the sky is blue". Then while they are frantically trying to fathom how we could possibly think they are racist, they desperately try to validate their nonsense via "Well...stereotypes are true!" line. All the while dishonestly making it seem like black men are the main perpetrators of keeping the stereotypes of black women in the public's eye.

    Ignorant whites are so dishonest, that it's frustrating at times.

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  9. ...and it makes it easy for someone like Steve (I've-been-married-three-times-but-I-can-tell-a-woman-how-to-get-and-keep-a-man) Harvey to write books and sell thousands of copies on what women (read: sistahs) should do to get booed up.

    To hell with that shit. I'd rather be single.

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  10. Sleepytime,

    You took the words right out of my mouth. If Black women just kiss up and just think it's ok for them to be used and abused..no way.. they can have that. These guys want women who don't think much about themselves.

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  11. And these articles which keep coming out urging Black women to get themselves a white man (without any serious nationwide articles urging white men to get themselves a black woman), are basically telling us to forget and pretend that the reality of the situation is wholly different from what it is.

    Basically they're saying: "Black women if your men can do it, why can't you?"

    Ala "Stories from a Dude" and his foolishness, SMH. White men probably figure since their women are leaving them for that sweet milk chocolate, they should go get them some too.

    This is why I'm happy to be a female. No self debasement/self hatred for me. If I want dick, I always know where to find it, thanks. And usually... it'll find me.

    I swear I never trust people that try to give me romantic advice. It's always people in relationships that I least want to emulate. I'll do okay on my own, thanks.

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  12. @ Amaya

    Why Steve Harvey's marriages didn't instantly invalidate him as being an expert on the subject is still beyond me. Last time I checked, society doesn't listen to multiple offending child molesters for parenting advice.

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  13. Why Steve Harvey's marriages didn't instantly invalidate him as being an expert on the subject is still beyond me. Last time I checked, society doesn't listen to multiple offending child molesters for parenting advice.

    Brilliantly stated. I get why Harvey wrote the books; he's rich, famous, and trying to make more money. However, why women actually go out and buy them begs the question, "WTF?"

    Basically they're saying: "Black women if your men can do it, why can't you?"

    Because hordes of spellbound white men aren't tripping over themselves to have serious relationships black women. White girls throw themselves at black men, and even some black women.

    White men DO approach black women often, but their approach is often horrific.

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  14. A long time ago when I was a Weebo, my friends use to ask me why I don't I like black woman. And it was exactly like what some idiot would say. Then later on after I started to open my eyes and see women in a different light. My mom shared with me this

    "older women as mothers, younger women as sisters with all chasteness." (1 Tim 5:2)

    Men should treat woman like how they would like someone to treat their mother or sister. By labeling women and stereotyping them is just as bad as abusing them.

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  15. @Ankh

    Yes which is exactly why this advice is falling on deaf ears. I'm a black woman, I'm not running after no damn body, I know my worth. I'll leave that to the white women/white identified women since that's what they do best.

    Why don't white men just admit that they want black women to be their concubines again, eschewing all dignity and self respect while we do it? That's who those articles are for: White men. They damn sure ain't for me.

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  16. @ Student of the World

    "Why don't white men just admit that they want black women to be their concubines again, eschewing all dignity and self respect while we do it?"

    Because they know that they can't be that blatant and disgusting anymore, so they engage in careful wording to "test the waters". All the while, hiding their true motives from the watchful eye of the general public, that will eviscerate them if they are uncovered. (The same tactic white males do with Scientific Racism, btw...)

    Why they are now targeting black women though, who they know are "hip" to them, is beyond me. Especially when they have a near endless supply of shameless and status seeking Asian, W.I.N.O. Hispanics, and (to a lesser, but increasing extent) Hindu women to treat as their "Exotic Spunk Dumps".

    Well...not really. I'm just being willfully dishonest. I could explain why, but it would be too off-topic.

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  17. @ Ankh

    "White girls throw themselves at black men"

    Ehh...they do, but it's rarely for anything meaningful/long lasting. Their motivations are really no different than a white man's. A quick fetish/curiosity driven smash or (AT BEST) a "secretive, shameful, and slumming long-weekend". The only difference is that it's just in greater numbers because ultimately, it's WOMEN who decide whether or not a (straight/bi) man gets lucky.

    (Whoa! I felt like I just channeled Obsidian for a moment...)

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  18. Have you noticed how in general, we seem to be the only group of people who are constantly chided and upbraided that we need to improve ourselves. Apparently everyone else is perfect except for black women.
    Whether we are talking about education, relationships, weight, or beauty, there is this idea that we are the only ones who NEVER measure up in any way, and therefore it is ALL our fault that no one wants us. Even if there are other people who have those same flaws, and in equal or greater amounts than we do, those reasons are accepted as a valid reason for pushing us to the bottom of the heap.
    And no one else is advised to chase down men. I've had that happen in my real life. I mean, if you as a man, always approach women, why the hell would you advise me that I need to chase someone. Or if as a woman, you always let someone ask you out, why don't you see it as offensive to suggest that I need to run someone down?
    Don't give advice that you don't give or live yourself.
    And don't act like the flaws that we have that are shared by everyone else somehow entitle us to nothing.
    Why does the fact that some white women are slutty, uncouth, or uneducated not become part of their reputations? Especially the slutty part since it seems to be the way that the untalented and uninteresting launch million dollar "careers." Shouldn't someone start saying, oh, I don't like white girls, b/c they flash their breasts for strangers and make sex tapes. I mean, if we are going to be stereotyped for the worst things anyone ever did, why not do the same to them?

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  19. "Why does the fact that some white women are slutty, uncouth, or uneducated not become part of their reputations? Especially the slutty part since it seems to be the way that the untalented and uninteresting launch million dollar "careers." Shouldn't someone start saying, oh, I don't like white girls, b/c they flash their breasts for strangers and make sex tapes. I mean, if we are going to be stereotyped for the worst things anyone ever did, why not do the same to them?"

    When I was 9 or 10, I use to see that alot on late night tv. Then I always noticed why don't parents say anything about that. But these are the same people who is at Wall Street because daddy knows somebody. Then you have Black women struggling while the White girl is getting ahead. But Black woman are bad and ghetto. Man the western world is crazy

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  20. @ Javan Nelums: "Men should treat woman like how they would like someone to treat their mother or sister. "

    I disagree. To me, this says women, and in this case, black women, are only worthy of respect because they are somehow related to you. That they need to be made important by way of blood or kin, otherwise, who gives a damn about them. Why can't the quote just be "Men should treat women, and indeed everyone, like the worthy human beings that they are."

    You shouldn't need to view women, black or any other, as family members to give them the respect most of them deserve. They should have it based on their humanity. I expect more from my men. I expect them to treat me, and other WOC, with respect because I am awesome as a person, not after they superimpose their sister's face on mine to control their racism. Why should they need to do that? Aren't these men strong enough to just treat me as a person without needing to resort to mind games?

    I understand what you mean, but I hope you get where I'm coming from.

    Hope I didn't derail, Ankh, it just drives me bonkers when people say stuff like that, despite their good intentions.

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  21. @ Nicthommi
    Cosign, Cosign, Cosign!

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  22. And no one else is advised to chase down men. I've had that happen in my real life. I mean, if you as a man, always approach women, why the hell would you advise me that I need to chase someone. Or if as a woman, you always let someone ask you out, why don't you see it as offensive to suggest that I need to run someone down?

    Million-dollar questions.

    Why does the fact that some white women are slutty, uncouth, or uneducated not become part of their reputations?

    Well, it has...just not amongst them.

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  23. Well it has...just not amongst them.
    LMFAO! You a fool ere! But you ain't never lied.

    White people are always the last to admit their faults, and they think that their shit doesn't stink. Um just because you're holding your nose doesn't mean we can't smell it yall.

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  24. @Sonic:


    "I disagree. To me, this says women, and in this case, black women, are only worthy of respect because they are somehow related to you. That they need to be made important by way of blood or kin, otherwise, who gives a damn about them. Why can't the quote just be "Men should treat women, and indeed everyone, like the worthy human beings that they are."

    In a sense we are all related. Blood or not. That's what the scripture is talking about.
    I understand. What i mean was that men should treat woman in general with the highest respect. Like although the guy may not know the woman personally, he should think before he act. Like is what he says might offend her?

    Also it's best to get to know the person first. Some people sometimes like to jump the gun and complain about the side effects.

    if this seems rushed, I'm sorry I have a stomach virus.

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  25. WOW its been a long time, I'm liking the new background.

    As usual, you are correct. I don't get these BW that are on the "lets stop talking about race and how BW are viewed in the USA before we scare the WM off!" bus. I really don't. If being with someone means I have to leave my experiences and history at the door then I'd rather be alone.

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  26. @ Zaire Y

    Good to have you back; you've been missed.

    And you are correct as well. There was a mantra we women had for a moment which I feel we REALLY need to bring back with a vengeance: No man is better than the wrong man - end of story.

    Female monophobia (fear of being alone) is a really big concern for me right now, especially amongst straight black women. Women need to stop and really ask themselves - not other people, themselves - "Why do I want a man? And if I don't want one, why should I?"

    Women need to stress that being alone is perfectly healthy and okay. And having standards, albeit reasonable ones, is also okay.

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  27. So...after enough black women have been inducted into the Order of the Doomed & Misguided, the self-help therapy market is going to return with a vengeance. This time, it will have all sorts of easily accessible, reasonably-priced eBooks filled with all manner of helpful how-to tips for thirsty black women on physically, mentally, and emotionally "reshaping" themselves to attract white men.

    This is already taking place, it's called the Black Women's Empowerment Movement or BWE. This so called movement has books, eBooks, blogs, radio shows, etc. all to teach black women how to be the "thin, classy, well educated, and mild mannered" women that white men love so much. *retches*

    Does BWE have advice for white men who want to peruse us us? Little to none. They never tell white men what they need to do in order to date or marry black women. They're never called out on their racism or bs. White men are treated with kid gloves, while black women are expected to do all the heavy lifting.

    Personally, I had to give this movement the middle finger. It's not empowering for black women to constantly be told how they don't measure up and need to change who they are to get a man. We're gorgeous just the way we are. Desirability has never been an issue for us, it that whole being seen as and treated like women/human beings that's a problem.

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  28. "Female monophobia (fear of being alone) is a really big concern for me right now, especially amongst straight black women. Women need to stop and really ask themselves - not other people, themselves - "Why do I want a man? And if I don't want one, why should I?"

    Women need to stress that being alone is perfectly healthy and okay. And having standards, albeit reasonable ones, is also okay."

    As a male I live by that standards. At my old job, alot of guys wanted me to get into a relationship or just to have sex. It seems odd.

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  29. I'm not sure I understand the motivation behind the whole "you are single because you suck."

    Why can't someone just be single by choice? Or I'm single b/c I have a lot of amazing qualities and would only give up my singleness for someone who had the same? (Of course, now we are getting into that whole Tyler Perry, get over yourself you uppity, educated negress. Why do you think you are too good for an illiterate and unemployed man with 10 baby mammas). Why would I LOWER my standard of living for an unworthy man?

    I mean, the way they tell it, everyone is beautiful and desirable except for black women. Our singleness is treated as proof that we are flawed and undesirable.

    Yet I see average and below average people of all ages, shapes, and sizes who successfully marry. So why is there this need to act like the reason they are married and I am not is because I am the most repugnant thing to ever walk the face of the Earth?

    It's great to say, oh, no one wants you because of "X" but then I see a thousand women who have X to the 10th degree and it doesn't impact their choices, so either you are wrong or you want me to believe that I am about as appealing as Jabba the Hut.

    Now granted, society definitely establishes a hierarchy that makes a black female 10 less worthy than an Asian 3 or a white female -5, but it is then hypocritical (or would it be correct to say oxymoronic) to say, yes, go chase down the white man (or really any other man) who has been taught that you are worthless.

    I see this system that clearly gives extra points despite other obvious flaws if you are of the right race.

    I mean after all, all of the WORST societal problems are laid at our feet and we are the only ones guilty of them.

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  30. but it is then hypocritical (or would it be correct to say oxymoronic) to say, yes, go chase down the white man (or really any other man) who has been taught that you are worthless.

    In a nutshell.

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  31. "Now granted, society definitely establishes a hierarchy that makes a black female 10 less worthy than an Asian 3 or a white female -5, but it is then hypocritical (or would it be correct to say oxymoronic) to say, yes, go chase down the white man (or really any other man) who has been taught that you are worthless."

    That's why we need to get rid of the female caste system.

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  32. Right...simply put but a huge order. White people don't want to give up their white privilege, whether it is access to education, economic success, or being the "most" beautiful.

    And how do you erase the effects of a message that has been sold for hundreds of years?

    The caste system doesn't just exist for women either. And in light of the past week, I'm more disturbed by the fact that a black life being worth less than a white life plays out. But a disproportionate amount of time is spent telling black women that they aren't good enough for anything. (And you know, it is a shame since there are better stories that need to be told so that people can be motivated to act). Now women as a whole get a lot of "oh my gosh, you are getting old"(and so funny how we never get praised for the fact that we are not ravaged by time and the elements the way that women of other races are) and "oh my gosh, you are fat," but the targeted criticism that you are just "in general" deficient no matter what your other qualities might be (oh wait, who am I kidding, we don't have any) seems to be reserved for black women.

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  33. "The caste system doesn't just exist for women either. And in light of the past week, I'm more disturbed by the fact that a black life being worth less than a white life plays out. But a disproportionate amount of time is spent telling black women that they aren't good enough for anything. (And you know, it is a shame since there are better stories that need to be told so that people can be motivated to act). Now women as a whole get a lot of "oh my gosh, you are getting old"(and so funny how we never get praised for the fact that we are not ravaged by time and the elements the way that women of other races are) and "oh my gosh, you are fat," but the targeted criticism that you are just "in general" deficient no matter what your other qualities might be (oh wait, who am I kidding, we don't have any) seems to be reserved for black women."

    this is the reason why I hate Glee, because the ONLY black character there is treated like a minor characters and fit the stereotypes of what white people made for black woman. I would go on more but it'll take up the whole discussion.

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  34. @Javan

    Glee is awful for several reasons. One of them being the race issue in which all the POC are treated like stereotypes and minor characters. This is apparently supposed to "change" this season.

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  35. "Glee is awful for several reasons. One of them being the race issue in which all the POC are treated like stereotypes and minor characters. This is apparently supposed to "change" this season."

    "If you stick a knife in my back nine inches and pull it out six inches, that's not progress. If you pull it all the way out, that's not progress. The progress comes from healing the wound that the blow made. They haven't even begun to pull the knife out. They won't even admit the knife is there."'
    Malcolm X.

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  36. @Javan...that is like the best quote ever!! And too true

    @Jean-bee. I've never heard of those BWE movements...is it just me or does it make you think of bowel movements? At any rate, I wish I could say I was surprised but you see many BW (and BM) who are happy to jump into discussions and point out how all of the other BW but them are loud, uncouth, uneducated, and ghetto, and we are therefore ruining their dreams of playing in the snow.

    As you put it so well, it's not about people finding us attractive. It's about them not acting like it's a nasty secret and thinking that a Happy Meal is all they need to come with to get it. Bleh, I see plenty of old white men who give me the wrong kind of looks to think that they think I'm ugly.

    I've read comments online that made me want to punch the person through my computer. I don't care about some silly white man wanting to marry me. A look at my own damn family tree shows me how much white men like black women. I care b/c those idiots are usually the ones giving out promotions, raises, and usually on the business end of guns, ladders, etc. So I don't need them seeing me as subhuman or my life and livelihood could be in jeopardy.

    No one else has to be able to leap tall building in a single bound to be respected at loved. No one.

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  37. @ Franklin

    This reminds me of how Ann Coulter was in a relationship with Jimmy Walker. Digest that information for a second.

    On a side note I'm starting to genuinely believe she really is like how The Boondocks portrayed her.

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  38. As someone dating a unicorn (lol, my bf's going to crack up when he reads that), I notice that the black people I've seen moving heaven and earth to get a white man/woman are usually treated as the bottom of the barrel. I've seen this happen in friendships as well, namely when a black girl plays sidekick to white women, and my take is that, unsurprisingly, white people will take advantage if you go begging for their crumbs. I've been friends with people like that in the past, and the relationship didn't last because I was turned off by how desperate they were for white folks' approval and by how I was held in higher esteem in their eyes for being "fortunate" enough to merit the attentions of white dudes.

    I should mention that where I'm from (Chicago), the vast majority of black women I knew saw white dudes hitting on them as a no-brainer. In Chicago, they definitely have to come correct because it's assumed that they'll have as much competition for black women as they will for white, Asian, or latina women, and even my friends who have no interest in IR dating treat it as a given that white dudes will talk to them when they're out. I'm also in my 20s though, and the heads of BWE tend to be in their 30s and have a much different perception of the "worth" of white mens' attention than my friends and I have.

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  39. @ Jasmin

    As someone dating a unicorn (lol, my bf's going to crack up when he reads that), I notice that the black people I've seen moving heaven and earth to get a white man/woman are usually treated as the bottom of the barrel. I've seen this happen in friendships as well, namely when a black girl plays sidekick to white women, and my take is that, unsurprisingly, white people will take advantage if you go begging for their crumbs.

    Thank you. You nailed it. That's why I write these posts the way I do; I want black women to come from a place of unapologetic strength. I want black women to develop the attitude of "non-unicorns need not apply."

    He doesn't have to be rich. He doesn't have to look like a movie star or have a 10-inch dick. He doesn't have to be an athlete. He just has to come correct, and any time any man refuses to do so for a black woman, it raises a red flag. It raises a red flag whether they approve or not, agree or not, or like it or not. They have to come correct and that's all there is to it.

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  40. Perla Buttons9/27/11, 5:04 AM

    @The Girl In Question:
    "Glee is awful for several reasons. One of them being the race issue in which all the POC are treated like stereotypes and minor characters. This is apparently supposed to "change" this season."

    Forgive me if this is OT, but I'm pretty effing sure the inconsistent malcontents who write Glee changed Santana, the Hispanic character* from a well-off doctor's daughter into a feisty roughneck from "Lima Heights".

    One ep she's making fun of John Stamos' character for not being a real doctor like her daddy (and semi-bragging about how her epic health insurance will cover anything). Later on in the series she's going all stereotypical POC angry girl** and and threatening Lead White Girl with declarations of her rough neighbourhood cred.

    *Yes, there is only one in the main recurring cast, AFAIK.

    ** Don't know how else to put it. The dialogue could have just been changed to "stereotype stereotype stereotype stereotype LIMA HEIGHTS!"

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  41. @Perla Buttons:

    What I've come to realize it's how white men view women of color. Stop me if this sounds familiar.

    Black: Loud, Ghetto
    Latina: Same as above, but speaks Spanish and more sexy and spicy.
    Asian: Quiet and obedient
    Native Americans: Spiritual Nature vixens
    Middle Eastern: Can't tell, Insert terrorist joke
    Indian Woman: Not Muslim, but just as sexy.

    Now theses are the things that some white guys tell themselves.

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  42. @Javan...yes, and most of those stereotypes also include the idea that we are sexually loose and they don't need to do anything but show up with a white penis and we will happily spread our legs...except for the Middle Eastern and Indian women I think. I think that they are stereotyped as being too oppressed to be slutty.

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  43. @Nicthommi: After my weebo period. I understand why some women feel the way they do. In fact it reminds me of a friend I had. Not one day goes when I don't think about her and what she has taught me.

    With Middle Eastern women, It's funny how people assume that because they wear a Hijabi that they are oppressed where as here it's ok to touch and feel up on a woman. And it's encouraged. I remember when I was shell-shocked twelve years ago when the Puerto Rican Day Parade was ruined when some guys was ripping shirts off the women.

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  44. ***blog moderation***

    Discussion is start to drift, people.

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  45. Well, I hope this is back on topic but when the Nita Jade Hanson story came out, one that that was sad (if I'm correct) is that her husband didn't show his face anywhere.
    Granted, if he isn't going to defend her against his racist family and friends, he's not going to out himself as being married to a "colored gal" on national TV.
    How does someone marry someone like that? Does she not realize that she is the poster child for why being alone might be the best thing for a lot of us?
    And this is also why someone who claims to be colorblind is just as bad...you can't have someone trying to gaslight you or convince you that it doesn't matter when some racist ish goes down.
    I'm glad that so far my friends who have white husbands have ones who get the point if they talk about getting passed over or belittled at work. One of my friends was telling me about telling her husband about a racist moment and before she finished he was like "effing racists." So he had clearly been listening to those stories about the subtle things that happen as she tries to advance her career, and he understood that the moves being made against her were because she was a black woman. She didn't have to explain it.
    It is really hard to find people who don't live through racism who understand that the form that we face is more insidious and harder to combat than burning crosses and hoods.

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  46. You know it's rare to find a decent person (Female/Male). From this discussion, it seems that some white guys make up stories about black females is similar to the slavery times and back in pre-civil rights era.

    My mom was telling that a white male at the time will rape a black woman like it's normal. Nowadays it's taken to a far deeper meaning.

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  47. @ Hean Bee - I gave up on those blogs for much the same reason - the message boiled down to 'improe yourself so that you can get a white man'. The more Nordic, the better (I kid you not).

    The one that really sent me running and screaming like my digital tail was on fire was a BWE blog that encouraged Black women in North America to marry and procreate with White men in so that 'the features that make it difficult' to move up in NA society will be 'softened'. Yes, you read that right. I must have read and re-read that paragraph on that blog ten times in one minute. I had a hard time accepting that a Black woman with sense wrote that hot mess of an advice - and I still do.

    I'm all for finding a committed and faithful life partner in a different package, BUT I really have to question some people's motivations having read blog after blog after blog of such 'empowering' tips.

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  48. And you are correct as well. There was a mantra we women had for a moment which I feel we REALLY need to bring back with a vengeance: No man is better than the wrong man - end of story.

    Female monophobia (fear of being alone) is a really big concern for me right now, especially amongst straight black women. Women need to stop and really ask themselves - not other people, themselves - "Why do I want a man? And if I don't want one, why should I?"

    Women need to stress that being alone is perfectly healthy and okay. And having standards, albeit reasonable ones, is also okay.


    Do I even need to state my position on this, chica???

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  49. @Leoprincess, I have to say, not having kids who looked like me and had my nice brown skin and fabulous hair is a major deterrent to procreating with a white man...well, really just one of many given the discussion and the realities of it all.
    I was a really cute little brown-skinned girl and I'd love to have daughters who look like that.
    That is so sad...and inaccurate since many of the biracial women in entertainment lauded for extraordinary beauty resorted to plastic surgery to "soften" said features.

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  50. @ Nicthommi - It's been well over a year since I read that, and my head is still spinning. Oh, and I forgot to mention that many of the bloggers regularly lashed out at Black Men for only wanting non-black or biracial/mixed women. *epic side-eye* If you don't think their worth a damn, why do you care so much what and who they do? I'm just saying.

    @ Jean Bee - Sorry for wrecking your name. Serves me right for typing in the dark.

    But back on topic - Given that the Post-Racial world isn't so Post-Racial after all, I can't fault BW for not marrying Whites as fast or as hard as their BM counterparts. Not to mention that I've been highly suspicious of all these 'Date Out' articles that seem to breakout like herpes every few years or so - since I know mainstream society doesn't really give two rat's asses about us.

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    Replies
    1. Thank you baby. You have no idea how refreshing your good sense and proud is to me, as a black man. And most of us love our black women. Interracial is not something black men are interested in as much as so many black women. 70 % of black men marry black women. under 30 pct marry white or other outside race. History even shows more of our women find it harder to resist whites and others, than it is for black men to resist whites and others. love 4 you all.

      and yeh youre absolutely correct. They could careless about us. But they constant try to keep us away from each other. They amount of hatred for black men DOES leave the fight in the hands of our women. If our women, most of them who are (demented by self hatred)stand for us unconditionally. These so-n-so's will back the hell off. We also should invest in each other and stop selling out period. love to my black women, young n all...regardless to anything else.

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