Comments on At the Bar: Why "Preference" is the Racist Mot du Jour

And hunter knocks it out of the park!!! claps Br...

2010-11-06T22:59:35.509-04:00

And hunter knocks it out of the park!!! *claps* Brava!!!

I have always said that any person can accept and reject whomever they want for whatever reason they see fit. However, people need to be honest with themselves and stop pretending they eluded the conditioning everyone else has been exposed to.

*nods* 'Tis all I'm asking.

That really helps my chances, then! :D

When people under the age of 30 tell me they're getting married or are about to have a child, I always shake my head. They don't like it, but tough shit.

(By the way, social psychologists have also not...

2010-11-06T21:20:01.962-04:00
(By the way, social psychologists have also noticed that people who wait until their mid-30s to marry, and who base their choices on intelligence and emotional compatibility, don't get divorced.)

That really helps my chances, then! :D

Yep, you pretty much said it all!! I have said tha...

2010-11-05T02:13:56.749-04:00
Yep, you pretty much said it all!! I have said that preferences are bullshit and heavily influenced by what is en vogue. I mean, its too obvious in so many different ways. Being a huge fan of science/biology I love your first point. There are many people who believe certain facial features, skin-tones, hair types, body types ect are inherently more attractive than others. Except for extreme and rare outliers every human combo is fair game when it comes to mating and reproduction. It goes AGAINST the trend of increasing biodiversity to find only one type of human to be the most evolutionary sound.

Like "hunter" said if all of these preferences were totally innocent and random the proportion of men that like White, Asian, Latina and Black females would be uniform. Psychological associations bleed into so-called preferences. Its no coincident that the groups with the worst gender based stereotypes(AM and BW) are the least preferred in this society.

Also, I love the way you handled anon/"?". These guys always use the behavior of their phantom black female friends to flip the script and project their own racial biases. They need to come clean and just say they reject people based on race, quit with the deflections, and call it a day.

All of what you said is truth, unfortunately the majority of people(especially narcissistic Americans) hold their 'preferences' and racial biases so near and dear that any challenge of their thinking rocks them to the core. They will fight, deflect blame, and shame anyone that dares to call them out. I have always said that any person can accept and reject whomever they want for whatever reason they see fit. However, people need to be honest with themselves and stop pretending they eluded the conditioning everyone else has been exposed to.

The line between preference and racist prejudice i...

2010-08-10T00:58:25.236-04:00
The line between preference and racist prejudice involves two elements:

1. Whether the preference is irrational and
2. Whether the preference is pervasive and systemic

Keeping in mind that people of certain races are not confined to certain physical characteristics or personalities (i.e. not all Asian men are short math geeks), it is 100% irrational to have a preference based on race. Of course, even if people of certain races were confined to certain physical traits, it would still be irrational to have a preference based on race because it is irrational to have preferences based on superficial physical traits.

As for element number 2, it's quite obvious that the "preferences" are not random. If they were, there would be an equal number of men who prefer black women compared to the number of men who prefer white, latino or asian women. Also, there would be an equal number of women who prefer asian men compared to the number of women who prefer white, latino or black men. Obviously, that is not occurring. The pervasive and systemic nature of these "preferences" come from America's racist, white supremacist culture and media. People who hold "preferences" that are aligned with America's racist cultural norms and values are racists themselves.

Americans like to think of themselves as individua...

2010-07-02T19:27:55.901-04:00
Americans like to think of themselves as individuals so it is impossible to admit how much group think is involved in our dating "preferences". The majority of preference comes from:
A. the media
B. peer pressure
C. our family

I'm guilty of the same thing. I have a "preference" for Black men but Black is such a broad category in this country that it includes everything from Wentworth Miller to Idris Elba.

It never even occurred to me that Asian guys could be fine until I was watching Heroes and noticed Ando and Mohinder being their sexy selves. Why? Because Asian men are never shown as describable in the American media.

Thanks!!!!

2010-06-08T20:49:06.314-04:00
Thanks!!!!

You're just killin' it Ankh. You really ar...

2010-06-08T18:33:16.399-04:00
You're just killin' it Ankh. You really are. I believe in conversations before we even have a "conversation", if you dig where I'm coming from.

It is important to me that I know where your head and heart are in any matter. If I am not connecting with what you have to say, then it's time to move on, looks be damned.

I actually believe in courtship as in we need to hang together whether formally or informally. We need to have some SERIOUS discussions.

I am not interested in wasting precious time w/clowns and knuckleheads.

When I say everyone, I mean everyone. Huma...

2010-03-05T14:21:36.286-05:00
When I say everyone, I mean everyone. Humans are a predictable breed, and there's always one lining up to--quite predictably--declare themselves and the people they know as the exception to everything.

These black women you Anonymous types always conveniently know who have white males friends but have zero interest in dating white men--have you ever stopped to ask them why that is? Have you told them to be brutally honest with you? Have you dissected the conversations/overall interactions they have with white men?

1) Because if they're rejecting white men on sight, then that is racist. You can't assume things about a person you haven't met and personally had an in-depth conversation with (see Final Thought above).

2) If they are accepting dates with white men, conversing with and then rejecting white men, then your questions should be more on what the men did or said wrong to put off the women.

As a woman who's spent the last 10 years in a state that's well over 90% white dating (and almost marrying) white guys, I can honestly tell you white guys often say/do the wrong things to black women (and I mean, horribly wrong things). The tendency to nitpick at black women for dumping/rejecting white guys is along the lines of blaming the victim. I'm not seeing/hearing a whole lot of white men trying to properly educate and constructively criticize other white men about interacting with women of color in a healthy and respectful manner. None of them are even willing to admit the possibility of fault. They simply deflect accountability and soothe their egos by indulging ridiculous paradoxes (e.g., "a black woman who refuses to sleep with me is a 'whore'" or "an educated, black female professional who found me uninteresting is 'ghetto'").

As for your comments about you, you're not fooling me. I've counseled your types and you all say the same thing--almost verbatim. There are always these "perfectly wonderful" women you know, but just aren't physically attracted to--"it's just not there"--bullshit.

You are affected by your environment. You are not immune and you are not the exception--welcome to Being Human 101. Humans simply tell themselves this to feel more assured when defending their "preference". It's a commom delusional human tendency called denial and the dating world is rife with it on all sides.

"Preference" has less to do with physical attraction, and more to do with psychological association--humans want what's "en vogue", and have for literally thousands of years. This obsession with image has helped create/preserve institutionalized misogyny, racism, and masochism (e.g., foot-binding, neck-lengthening, skin-bleaching, force-feeding/starvation, and surgical augumentation).

Social psychologists have noticed that people today often get married because of this "preferential" thinking, and the results of this thinking are displayed above. I have actually counseled such people and they always say the same thing, "I never thought it would be me"--a classic mistake.

(By the way, social psychologists have also noticed that people who wait until their mid-30s to marry, and who base their choices on intelligence and emotional compatibility, don't get divorced.)

This is one of those instances where everyone--at ...

2010-03-05T11:03:05.210-05:00
This is one of those instances where everyone--at some point in the conversation--drops the "I am not a shallow racist, but..

Which "everyone" are you referring to? I know black women who have zero interest in dating white men,though they do have white male friends. Does that make them racist?

There are women whose personalities I love, but I have absolutely no physical attraction to them. Nor is it society or Hollywood telling me to feel that way. It simply isn't there. I do agree that we are attracted to people we get know, but there has to be some physical connection as well-at least for me.

You are most definitely welcome! I didn't exp...

2010-03-04T23:12:02.658-05:00
You are most definitely welcome! I didn't expect anyone to comment so fast!

Until I can gather my thoughts and write something...

2010-03-04T22:29:41.155-05:00
Until I can gather my thoughts and write something more intelligent, I must say...
Wow. Thank you. As a newly divorced (from a white guy) woman of color who has always dated white guys and is re-entering the dating world in my late 30s, simply meeting people is...different. Things - no - people - have changed since I was in my 20s. Aside from people "my age" being in families, with children, it's a bit dismaying to feel generally rejected where I used to feel acceptance. I'm checking out some online sites, but I don't feel too optimistic about them. Because of snap judgments based on appearances and inaccurate, short personality assessments, I think there's a tendency toward outright rejection and strange fetishisism, to name a few roadblocks. I'm hoping to organically meet someone, much as things used to happen.
Overall, you've opened my eyes and given me some things to think about and look for.

Comments on At the Bar: Why "Preference" is the Racist Mot du Jour

And hunter knocks it out of the park!!! *claps* Br...

(By the way, social psychologists have also not...

Yep, you pretty much said it all!! I have said tha...

The line between preference and racist prejudice i...

Americans like to think of themselves as individua...

Thanks!!!!

You're just killin' it Ankh. You really ar...

When I say everyone, I mean everyone. Huma...

This is one of those instances where everyone--at ...

You are most definitely welcome! I didn't exp...

Until I can gather my thoughts and write something...

And hunter knocks it out of the park!!! claps Br...